Naaltsoos baa yáshtiʼ:Íiyisíí Naaltsoos/archive1

_{bichʼą́ą́h naʼadá} 

Yaateeh, shí Náábéého' bizaad wooltá' dóó ak'é'alchí' t'áá shił bééhozingo' at'é', adóó éí t'áá haadá niiłtso'go' akáá 'ánashwó' doolééł (Saad bik'i'ninaashji' doolééł). Łá'go' t'éíyá' béé hadéísdzí' díí éí Diné' biná'hágá' adóó bikáá adááłí'ni', t'áá "secular writing" t'éíyá' dá'bikáágo' nizhǫ́ ni' doolééł. Díí t'áá ní'hah bá'ada'hónǫ́sin doolééł. Adóó Diné' bizaad wooltá' dóó k'é' alchii' éí ayó shiłnizhǫ́ni' adóó bá'shihozhǫ́ diné' yida'néédlį́į́go'.

Is it possible to learn this language? Looks quite imposible.....

Of course it is. Probably not easy, but that can be said for lots of languages. Maybe someday...  :-) 75.68.60.149 17:06, 16 T'ą́ą́chil 2007 (UTC)

Adminship

Would anyone be opposed to me having temporary/permenant sysopship on this Wikipedia? I am an administrator on the English Wikipedia, en:User:Deskana, so I can be trusted. I want it to protect a few important pages and fight blatant vandalism. --Deskana 18:00, 20 T'ą́ą́chil 2007 (UTC)

• Support Jmerkey 05:19, 21 T'ą́ą́chil 2007 (UTC)
• Support ✓ gáagii 13:45, 2 Bini'ant'ą́ą́ts'ózí 2008 (UTC)

Hello im a native american from sanostee new mexico and this is my navajo language and its very easy to pronouns if you put ur mind to it.

Adminship

As per above really. I would like to fight vandalism here, even though it isn't that active. Would love the chance to learn a little more Navajo. Rudget 16:44, 24 Níłch'its'ósí 2007 (UTC)

Ya'at'eeh Keshmish OldManRivers 23:31, 25 Níłch'itsoh 2007 (UTC)

Another Native Language Wikipedia

I have started a Lakota language Wikipedia at the incubator. Could it be added to the Main Page of this Wikipedia under the Wikis in other Native languages section please? The main page is here. Thank you, Zrs 12 19:00, 5 Ya'iishjáástsoh 2008 (UTC)

P.S. If anyone reading this can write Lakota please contribute to the project. It is in desperate need of articles.

Proposal for Proper Encoding for the Glottal Stop Character

Hello, my name is Paul Hunt and I am currently working developing fonts for Adobe. While it is true that there are currently not a lot of great font options for representing Dine Bizaad adequately, there are some text processing issues that should be addressed as the Navajo version of the Wikipedia begins to take off. One major issue is that of the proper character encoding for the glottal stop character. At this point in time, I find that there in inconsistent implementation as to which Unicode character should be used. If I am not mistaken, the character ʼ (u+02BC) should be used instead of ' (u+0027) or ’ (u+2019). The character I am proposing is designated in the Unicode standard as representing a glottal stop, whereas the other two are punctuation marks. In order for online documents in Navajo to flourish and be useful, this really needs to become standardized and those entering articles should develop good practices to enable the searching and sharing of information in a digital format. If anyone feels that I am wrong in this, please give good reason and arguments why this should not be so. Thank you. Pablohoney77

Interface question

Yá'át'ééh! I don't speak Navajo, so please pardon my use of English to ask this question. I see the lovely "insert" with special characters below this edit box, I am currently trying to renovate the Cherokee Wikipedia and would love to be able to do something like that over there. Many people have a hard time typing the Cherokee alphabet so having it clickable might help. If someone could give me a quick walk-through (I think I am technically minded enough to understand if pointed in the right direction) about how to do that over there, I would be super happy. Thanks kindly, Nesnad 16:53, 21 Ghąąjį 2009 (UTC)

(answer @ User's Cherokee-wiki page Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 17:51, 21 Ghąąjį 2009 (UTC))

Small request

Hello! I am a Polish wikipedian and I would like to ask you for your help - writing a new article about former Polish President who won the Nobel Peace Prize in 1983 – Lech Wałęsa. I have looked for his biography in your Wikipedia but without success. Polish Wikipedians will be grateful for your help. Thank you so much in advance! PS you can find the English version of the article here. Best wishes from Poland, Patrol110 12:11, 25 Níłchʼitsoh 2009 (UTC)

Need translation

Is there a Navajo word for "bigfoot" or "sasquatch"? 24.29.228.33 21:02, 1 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for your question. This might help for further research. Ahéheeʼ Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 22:17, 1 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

So he is a "giant oafish creature" called Yeí’tso? Is this spelling correct? Do we have contacts in the Navajo Nation (maybe a Navajo language teacher at a college there) who can confirm things when we have questions like this? 24.29.228.33 00:37, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

The link you were given explains it. Apart from that, we do not give information about Navajo knowledge; the questions you ask go into a direction that are neither easily nor comfortably answered. You can try asking others, but will likely receive a similar answer. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 00:46, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't understand your answer. I want to make sure the diacritics are absolutely correct (not some ad hoc spelling found on an English-language news site) before I make an en:Wiktionary entry. Regarding having contacts in the native-speaking community, such as teachers or professors of Navajo language, that could be a very valuable thing. Do we have any such contacts? This encyclopedia could be a good tool for their Navajo-language learners. 24.29.228.33 00:48, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

I see, I found a posting from a native speaker on the welcome page for this encyclopedia and s/he asks that we write only about secular Navajo issues, except for those that have been published elsewhere on the Internet. I didn't know that this being was a spiritual being, but if it is, I understand if adherents of traditional Navajo spiritual ways would not want it to be written about. 24.29.228.33 01:01, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

By the way, I think the correct spelling of the giant is yéʼiitsoh. —Stephen 02:01, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

For questions about spelling, you should consult Young & Morgan, The Navajo Language, University of New Mexico Press. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 02:50, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Devil's Tower National Monument

Hi, is there a Navajo name for the Devil's Tower National Monument? 24.29.228.33 00:35, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

It is not located where Navajo is spoken. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 00:47, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

I have found articles at this Wikipedia about places located all around the world. 24.29.228.33 00:49, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Yes, but since it is not in Navajo country, it would have to be translated. Most people, even Navajos, probably use the English name or, if they know it, the Lakota name. A translated name would not be recognized. —Stephen 02:06, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Really? I thought Navajo people invented their own words for almost everything (the famous lemon example, saying "the fruit that is being yellow that is being sour" rather than just saying "lemon"). I have a feeling there is indeed a Navajo-language term for this, as this landform is so important to so many neighboring nations. 24.29.228.33 06:11, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

I would encourage you to create an account and tell us about yourself. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 06:35, 2 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I shall do that. But how does the above answer my question? 24.29.228.33 08:18, 4 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Native American flute

I think we need an article on the Native American flute (to interwiki to the en:WP article), but cannot find the Navajo name. Does someone know it and can begin a stub? 71.66.97.228 05:31, 6 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

...and since you complimented the background, here's a little riddle for you to tease your brain: How do you say "French fries"... in French?!?! dude... atsiighąąʼshąʼ...Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 08:35, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

"Random article" button

Is there a "random article" button at the left, as there is at other Wikipedias? I can't seem to find it. 71.66.97.228 05:43, 6 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

No, we don’t have a "random article" button set up yet. —Stephen 03:52, 7 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Naayée tsídiʼ

Re: coinage of the word naayée tsídiʼ is this word in use in the Navajo language where Navajo is spoken (for example, in the educational system)? If so, when was it coined and by whom, and in which print sources may it be found? I am posting this here because my post was removed from the talk page of the article in question without first being answered, as many of my other posts have been. I have added a couple of hundred Navajo words to en:Wiktionary, working to help build this language's base there, and don't find it friendly that questions asked in good faith are wiped clean without answer. They don't even do that at en:Wiktionary, where veteran editors are well known for their unfriendliness to newcomers. Thanks so much. 71.66.97.228 19:24, 10 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Kótʼéego doo nihíká anánílwoʼ da - Wikiibíídiiya beehazʼą́ąnii yidíiltah nidishníí lá. Nááná díí kweʼé Wikiibíídiiya doo saad binaaltsoos átʼée da. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 20:47, 10 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

You are more accustomed to the way English and the closely related Indo-European languages of Europe, and a few others with which we have heavy interaction. Vast amounts of materials have been translated back and forth among these languages since they became separate languages and pretty much everything in one has a rather exact translation (often a borrowing, like Archaeopteryx) in each of the others. But when dealing with vastly different languages, especially where little translation has occurred between them and our familiar languages, a lot of things we think of as universal are simply missing. In particular, many of them (such as Navajo) do not readily adopt English words for anything...so things have to be said using native terms or the speaker has to switch to English. In particular, things are not categorized the same way English has them. Where English may have only one term for something, Navajo may distinguish various forms of it and have several different terms. Where English has different terms for what we think are fundamentally different things, Navajo may have only one term. For example, in Navajo lettuce and cabbage are the same thing. Alligators and crocodiles are the same thing. OTOH, where in English an ant is an ant is an ant, and every different ant is an ant, to the Navajo they are not the same thing, and they have different words for different ants. It is the reverse of the crocodile/alligator situation.

In the case of naayée tsídiʼ, it literally means "dinosaur bird". You ask about how and where naayée tsídiʼ is used, and who uses it and so on. Remember that Archaeopteryx is not a familiar English word, and most Americans do not know the word and do not use it. Only in a rarefied academic atmosphere do you find it, or in certain specialized books. Unfortunately, not many books are written in Navajo, and most college courses are taught in English. But if you are in a college classroom where Navajo is the medium of instruction, naayée tsídiʼ is what they say if they are speaking about this bird. In order to distinguish it using English rules along English lines of categorization, it would be necessary to add something in English, like naayée tsídiʼ-Archaeopteryxígíí.

Don’t get so concerned with how Navajo manages to handle new terms until you at least gain a working knowledge of the language. You’re putting the cart before the horse. —Stephen 03:39, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Thank you; this is extremely helpful. I was just wondering if these are pre-existing terms, and, if so, where you few editors here who are knowledgeable in this language find them, or whether you are simply inventing the terms yourselves. (There are several articles at this Wikipedia, for example, for space exploration-related or computer-related subjects, which are of recent origin in the English language.) 71.66.97.228 07:18, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

To make new terms for computers and science, English borrows from other languages, especially Latin and Greek. That’s why the English terms are of recent origin. Navajo draws on its native lexicon. The word for acquired immunodeficiency syndrome translates to the disease of the disease-fighter (means disease of the immune system). A computer is metal by means of it writing is done automatically. For beer you say "the one that has saliva". Bingo is "moving the beans around". Just as the Vatican can talk about astonauts and computers in Latin, and the Orthodox Russian priests in Alaska can talk about them in Old Church Slavonic, Navajos can talk about them using ordinary native words. —Stephen 11:50, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

This is fantastic. I hope that en:Wiktionary can eventually contain all of these etymologies, which make the logic of the language very clear. My illustrated dictionary is on the way (only US$6 plus shipping from Amazon). 71.66.97.228 01:54, 12 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Background

The pastel background that resembles a Navajo diyogí is just lovely. Whoever came up with that, my hat is off to you. 71.66.97.228 07:18, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

You just earned some points with me ;) Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 07:49, 11 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Sp?

In the logo, this is spelled Wikiibíídiya, but in this article it is Wikiibíídiiya. Which is correct, -iya or -iiya? Same thing, by the way, with ínsadoobíídiya and ínsadoobíídiiya. —Stephen 13:46, 13 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

yeah, my bad, I haven't come around re-doing it yet, and I don't have the fonts in this computer. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 13:47, 13 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

So Wikiibíídiiya and ínsadoobíídiiya are correct? 71.66.97.228 06:53, 16 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Dude -- both are anglicisms. There is no "correct," we just made that up to spell it phonetically... if you wanna say encyclopedia, you gotta bust out "naaltsoos bikáaʼgi ádóoleʼé doonaʼnitłʼahgo bikʼeʼeshchíʼgo bikááʼ ályaa áádóó doonaʼnitłʼohgo bikʼiʼjiʼdiʼ dootʼį́į́ł" ...or something like that --- but that won't fit into the logo... Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 07:49, 16 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Planet names

Are there alternate, indigenous names for any of the planets (especially the ones that are easily visible, like Mars and Venus), apart from the names of Latin/Roman origin that are used for the entry titles? Or are those indigenous names no longer used? 71.66.97.228 09:33, 16 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

Tricky. In order not to break policy, we will stick with the "imported" names, since going into Navajo cosmology could be borderline-sacred. I can tell you that Venus is Sǫʼtsoh Łigaii, but that would not refer to the scientifically explored planet. Obviously, the ones invisible to the naked eye have, as far as I know, no other names. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 10:39, 16 Yas Niłtʼees 2010 (UTC)

about alphabet

There are some ejective consonants in this language. And you use this apostrophe ( ʼ ) for example pʼ , tʼ etc. I wonder that why you use this apostrophe. Can i use different apostrophes like ( ' ) or ( ’ ). Thanks good project and nice language. --Dacxiri 13:40, 23 Wóózhchʼį́į́d 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the question. It was initially set up with a regular apostrophe ( ' ), and you will still find some of the namespaces rendered that way; however, the "correct" way is the glottal sign ( ʼ ) - in addition to that, the apostrophe causes trouble when setting up the Java script-based .css and .js-files, since Java reserves ( ' ) for strings and other commands, while ( ʼ ) is treated as a regular "letter". We hope to transition to the glottal sign ( ʼ ) throughout soon. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 16:45, 23 Wóózhchʼį́į́d 2010 (UTC)

Update: transition to ( ʼ ) is now complete. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 07:40, 10 Tʼą́ą́chil 2010 (UTC)

Good lucks :) --Dacxiri 05:18, 15 Tʼą́ą́chil 2010 (UTC)

Huh?

The theme ou=f your wiki seems to be unusual --TheChampionMan1234 (talk) 07:05, 22 Níłchʼitsʼósí 2012 (UTC)

Nizaadkʼehjí doo diistsʼaʼ da. I do not understand what you are saying. —Stephen ^{(> haneʼ)} 09:10, 22 Níłchʼitsʼósí 2012 (UTC)

Hatʼíísh óolyé usual? Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 ^{> haneʼ} 11:56, 22 Níłchʼitsʼósí 2012 (UTC)